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Math Help - Finite field

  1. #1
    ynj
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    Finite field

    Show that every element in a finite field can be written as the sum of two squares.
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    you do this yourself --

    1. consider F^*. prove that at least half of its elements are squares.
    2. from this you conclude your result.
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  3. #3
    ynj
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    Quote Originally Posted by nirax View Post
    you do this yourself --

    1. consider F^*. prove that at least half of its elements are squares.
    2. from this you conclude your result.
    yeah....I know but I'm sorry that I just have no idea how to get 2 from 1...
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    ok i will give u one more hint. suppose exactly half of them are squares (when is this the case ? when it is not ?) then the squares form an index 2 subgroup of F^*. the squares you can write as 0+a^2 .. suppose some element is not expressible as sum of two squares, then what happens if you take the squares and take the additive group generated by them ? if you add 0 to that set, will it become a subfield ? if so, what should be its cardinality ?
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  5. #5
    ynj
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    hmm...I am sorry that i cannot understand your idea..
    if one element can not be written as the sum of two squares, it does not mean it will not be in the additive group generated by the squares since it may be the sum of three squares..
    if it is in the additive group generated by the squares, then the group will be the original group since its order is greater than the half of the original order..then nothing would happen??
    May be there are some mistakes in above statements..but I am just confused...
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    call A as the multiplicative group of squares. so we decompose F = A \cup \{0\} \cup B. B is the set of non squares. suppose an element a is not expressible as sum of two squares. consider a - A. this set must be the same as B. consider x = a - a^2. clearly x \in B

    but B was the coset of the multiplicative group A in F^*. so B = a.A. it follows that there exists a y s.t

    x = a.y^2 = a - a^2

    \Rightarrow a (y^2 - 1 + a) = 0
    \Rightarrow y^2 = a - 1

    RHS belongs to B whereas LHS belongs to A which are disjoint.
    Last edited by nirax; August 28th 2009 at 09:00 AM. Reason: correction
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  7. #7
    ynj
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    why a+A=B?
    if we use contrapositive proof, suppose a+b^2=c^2, then a=c^2-b^2...no contradiction..
    if a+b^2=0, then a=-b^2,any contradiction?
    -b^2 is a square, or not?
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by ynj View Post
    why a+A=B?
    if we use contrapositive proof, suppose a+b^2=c^2, then a=c^2-b^2...no contradiction..
    if a+b^2=0, then a=-b^2,any contradiction?
    -b^2 is a square, or not?
    a+A must be the same as B else it intersects with A then a wud be expressible as sum of two squares. also note that A and B are equicardinal. -b^2 may not be a square as -1 is not a square in all fields.
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    for example in F_7, -1 is not a square. whereas it is a square in all characteristic 2 fields.
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  10. #10
    ynj
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    Quote Originally Posted by nirax View Post
    a+A must be the same as B else it intersects with A then a wud be expressible as sum of two squares.
    hmm...would you please explain it in detail? In my previous post, I actually try to prove a+A=B. but we get a=b^2-c^2,not a=b^2+c^2!!
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  11. #11
    ynj
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    Note that A is multiplicative group,not a additive group...So a+A is not a coset..
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    Quote Originally Posted by ynj View Post
    hmm...would you please explain it in detail? In my previous post, I actually try to prove a+A=B. but we get a=b^2-c^2,not a=b^2+c^2!!
    see ...

    a + A has the same cardinality as A as well as B. also it cannot contain 0 as a is not a square. so it follows that a + A must either be B or A or in intersects with both. in the last two cases if it intersects nontrivially with A, it means there exist an element z^2 in A such that a + y^2 = z^2, but this is a contradiction to what we assumed about a.

    edit :: this is erroneous, proof corrected above
    Last edited by nirax; August 28th 2009 at 09:04 AM.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ynj View Post
    Note that A is multiplicative group,not a additive group...So a+A is not a coset..
    i am not saying a+A is a coset ... but B is a coset .. and a+A happens to be the same as B

    edit :: this is erroneous, proof corrected above. plz read a-A in place of a+A
    Last edited by nirax; August 28th 2009 at 09:06 AM.
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  14. #14
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    oopps!!!

    instead of taking a+A, plz take a-A, it all works out then. i am sorry for this confusion. i noticed this when i myself wrote what u were hinting. i will correct above too.
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  15. #15
    ynj
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    Quote Originally Posted by nirax View Post
    see ...

    it means there exist an element z^2 in A such that a + y^2 = z^2, but this is a contradiction to what we assumed about a.
    ok....may be the statement of the question is unclear....I think the sum means +,not -.
    I am not quite clear where is contradiction in your statement. a+y^2=z^2,a=z^2-y^2. if the sum actually means +, then z^2-y^2 is not a sum of two squares.......If the sum can mean -, then no problem exists.....
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