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Math Help - linear algebra Gram-Schmidt in Function Spaces problem

  1. #16
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    For the first-order derivative, you won't actually need the product rule - just the chain rule. But for the second derivative on up, you will need the product rule and the chain rule, and the sum rule, etc. So no, you don't take the derivative of the whole function. Like I said, derivatives are an operator. Operators only operate on what is to their right. Example:

    \displaystyle{x^{2}\frac{d}{dx}\,x^{6}=x^{2}(6x^{5  })=6x^{7}.} Another example:

    \displaystyle{\sin(x)\,\frac{d^{2}}{dx^{2}}\,\cos(  x)=-\sin(x)\,\frac{d}{dx}\,\sin(x)=-\sin(x)\cos(x).}

    One more example for good measure:

    \displaystyle{\ln(x)\,\frac{d^{2}}{dx^{2}}\,\sinh(  x^{2})=2\ln(x)\,\frac{d}{dx}(x\cosh(x^{2}))=2\ln(x  )(x(2x)\sinh(x^{2})+\cosh(x^{2})).}

    And you can simplify further, but that's not the point of this example. Get the idea?

    However, all of this misses the point. You need to imagine what those derivative operators are doing to the right-most (only!) exponential function. As you keep taking more and more derivatives, what happens to the even-ness of odd-ness of the overall functions?
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  2. #17
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    Oh ok, I was taking the derivative of the whole thing.
    When I take the first derivative I get
    -e^{x^{2}}(-2xe^{-x^{2}})

    I'm not sure what happens to the even-ness and odd-ness of functions as you take more derivatives though.
    Last edited by SpiffyEh; August 17th 2010 at 11:51 AM.
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  3. #18
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    Too many minus signs in there, I think, but that's much better.

    However, what you should really be doing is taking the derivative of an arbitrary even function. An even function satisfies f(x) = f(-x) for all x. If I take the derivative of both sides of that equation, what do I get?
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  4. #19
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    if you take the derivative of both sides of f(x) = f(-x) you should get f(-x) = f(x)
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  5. #20
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    *buzzer, buzzer* You forgot the chain rule. You also forgot to include derivative symbols.

    You can do this!
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  6. #21
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    umm... well i took the 2nd derivative of the original function if thats what you mean and got
    -2xe^{x^{2}}(2xe^{-x^{2}})-e^{x^{2}}(2e^{-x^{2}} - 4x^{2}e^{-x^{2}})
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  7. #22
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    I think it'll be more instructive just to consider the equation f(x) = f(-x), and completely ignore the Rodrigues formula for now. What happens when I differentiate both sides of f(x) = f(-x)?
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  8. #23
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    umm you get f'(x) = f'(-x)?
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  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiffyEh View Post
    umm you get f'(x) = f'(-x)?
    Chain rule on the RHS!
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  10. #25
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    f'(-x)f(-x) + f(-x)f'(-x)?
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  11. #26
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    Not exactly.

    To make it clearer: Let g(x) = -x

    Then f(-x) = f(g(x)) and so \frac{df(-x)}{dx} = \frac{df(g(x))}{dx} = ?
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  12. #27
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    \frac{df(g(x))}{dx} * \frac{dg(x)}{dx}
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  13. #28
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    Exactly. Now write that with -x instead of g(x) - what do you get?
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  14. #29
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    \frac{df(-x)}{dx} * \frac{-dx}{dx}
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  15. #30
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    Good.

    So to Ackbeet's point - you got that if f(x) is an even function, ie. f(x) = f(-x) \forall x then:
    f'(x) = -f'(-x), which means f'(x) is an odd function.
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